[Rewatch] Jigokuraku • Hell's Paradise Episode 10 Discussion

**Hell’s Rewatch Host, subbed**

[Welcome back, everyone!](#michaelwink)

[Here were my original reactions to episode 10](https://www.reddit.com/r/anime/comments/14636m1/jigokuraku_hells_paradise_episode_10_discussion/jno9n60/), if anyone wants to read those.

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- [Pfff](https://i.imgur.com/CC2DqUr.png) [](#kukuku2)

- [Character development!](https://i.imgur.com/vZkTkTJ.png)

- [Of course Tamiya is jealous about not being able to fight the Tensen](https://i.imgur.com/cUiWIAH.png) while [Fuchi immediately goes into analysis mode.](https://i.imgur.com/F5znA3c.png) [](#kukuku)

- [Well, we’re watching an anime of you in the present day.](https://i.imgur.com/iAfNow9.png) [](#etotamadunno)

- [Mei is suddenly older.](https://i.imgur.com/HTPbSoU.png) [](#shock)

- [The criminal Yuzuriha killed early on is actually relevant!](https://i.imgur.com/rq7hiN1.png) [](#flyingbunsofdoom)

- [We finally have a name for that mysterious power!](https://i.imgur.com/jvHeTIH.png) [](#hypeeyes)

- [Love how it cuts from Yuzuriha wishing there was a hot teacher explaining all this](https://i.imgur.com/q97ajd1.png) and then [it cuts straight to Shion.](https://i.imgur.com/wE5GffL.png) Incredibly based. [](#cinema)

- [That he is, Nurugai, that he is.](https://i.imgur.com/LS2QLkH.png) [](#kotohoops)

- [Chobei is insane and I have to respect him for it.](https://i.imgur.com/wrD73uz.png) [](#faito)

- [What a *fun* cliffhanger.](https://i.imgur.com/TCI9Cs9.png) [](#crazedlaugh)

**Rewatcher**

Oh btw have fun noticing Tenza bleeding out in the OP if you hadn't already.

How appropriate to begin an episode titled "Yin and Yang" with Gabimaru about to get himself killed, _again_, because he keeps seeing everyone and everything as obstacles or threats, before calming down and realizing he stands to gain much more from cooperating with Tamiya and Fuchi both for strength and information, because the Tensen are not a force any of them will be able to overcome alone.

And information we get! Starting with Senta pushing forth a pretty compelling theory that demystifies this place. He thinks the island cannot be truly divine because it's too clumsy, too artificial. In fact, he doubts even the spiritual practices that Hoko speaks of are an organic development of the culture. Instead it much more resembles the cult of Moro Makiya, the convict Yuzuriha seduced and got killed. An ad hoc and hastily assembled system that only superficially resembles a well developed and entrenched ideology. That explains the various Buddhist and Taoist elements of the island, mixed and matched with no rhyme or reason.

We may also see this kind of attitude among the character writing, for example with Tamiya explaining that he has no interest in the Elixir of Life, instead seeking to become immortal on his own natural strength and through memory. A heretical ideal, _if_ this was really Shinsenkyou.

We also get more exposition on the power system and the Tensen. Pretty unique for a Battle Shounen to finally explain what the power system is about 10 episodes in. In any case, the Taoism imagery of the island is not entirely unwarranted, as apparently the Tensen and some of the locals can use Tao, THE Tao, the one that can't be named. The vital energy of the cosmos. That's right we were tricked into watching a cultivation story!

The Tensen are the maximum users of Tao and they exemplify it's greatest powers. It makes one near invulnerable, incredibly powerful not just physically but able to attack and defend beyond the realm of kinetics, thermodynamics, maybe even biochemical.

Mei also mentions the Tanden, which Fuchi identifies as a vital point from Chinese traditional medicine. It's actually one of the Dāntián I talked about in a previous thread, the lowest of the three identifies, located around three inches bellow the navel and three inches inside the body, also known as the mingmen, the "door of destiny". From context in the later fight we can understand that if the Tensen, maybe if _any_ being has a core, it's this.

I love how even though the concrete explanation of Tao is learned in the island, it is clear many characters have already been using it or have a predisposition for it, which leads credence to its universality even if the rest of the place might be bogus. There's Shion who became more aware of the energy of everything after loosing his sight, and Chōbei who simply has good instincts. Beyond concrete characters, obviously it's principles have already been floated around in the development of the narrative, with Sagiri and Gabimaru's arcs, as well as more minor details such as the kenjutsu techniques that Shion is teaching Nurugai, such as "grip firmly when you strike, else grip loosely".

These is a philosophical practice aimed at harmony with the universe and economy of effort which I'd love to elaborate more on, but as the characters are on the process of assimilating it, I'll leave that for later ;)

For now, starting today until the last episode I'll share four short philosophy documentaries from a philosophy channel I really like about the central currents of the story... although there's a caveat... it's in Spanish. However, the guy's diction and sentence structure is good so the machine TL subs are for the most part accurate or at least understandable, I checked myself. It only really struggles with foreign terms or names in Chinese or Latin, for example. In any case if anyone has questions about the translation I'll be happy to answer.

Of course, the one for today is as the episode name, on [Yin Yang](https://youtu.be/PM3gE1GBP0U?si=DuZWqMS5G6hIReF9)

Finally, I found the following meaning for Doshi, the new enemies introduced today: "a leader, a guide, one who guides men to Buddha's teaching, applied also to Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, and to leaders of the ritual in Buddhist services." So they are the closest to the Tensen, and they organize the Monshin and Soshin, but not quite on their level.

Rewatcher

Dub

Right...Senta just lays out what I've been trying to imply:The island is a mismash of faiths. This comes off as extremely cult-y to the Japanese as Aum is still technically a thing over there. Also, Abe was shot for a reason. But yeah, nothing quite makes sense because apparently someone sewed this together and we get a name I do not recognize at all.

We also get a new monster that can reason and talk. Tao is brought up in a way that resembles the Force, which is likely because Lucas stole the concept. Mei...grows, and this is deeply established, I know at least from YYH but probably Fist of the North Star, given age. Tenjou Tenge used this trashily.

QotD:1 I am the sort of being you'd prefer not to do that

2 Mei is more my speed.

**First timer ~~dumbfounded by Mei's explanations~~ trying to makes sense of that melting pot of a power system, French Subs**

*On today's episode:* Senta finally assert himself, Gabimaru and Gantetsusai have a mental sparring and... [What ? Mei is evolving!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fmitymsGww)........ [Mei evolved into talking Mei!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJ63z7FeWdc)

Gabimaru can thanks his wife, has he not learn her way of politeness, he would have been killed by Fuchi and Gantetsusai right here.

[](#towel)

Instead he got two new (temprorary) allies and a teacher so he can begins his training arc... Even if she is terrible at explaining things.

Speaking of doing expositions, I understand MAPPA's staff to mix the differents explanations in order to match with the mixed influences of the island. It was actually a neat idea to show how differents philosophies and religions can lead to the same result in practice. But, at least for me, it made said explanations really confusing to follow and understand. I could have done it without having to take an aspirin.

[](#hardthink)

Anyway, Chobe climbing out of the so-called inescapable pit made me chuckle, and proved the Tensens aren't the invulnerable beings they believe they are.

And what now ? We got the Tensens servants ? Nice, a new entry for my theory corner.

[](#missingpiece)

… Actually, Chobe could be dying for good here. It would checks out with Toma relying too much on him and having to develop his full potential without his presence. Just like Nurugai is about to do with Shion help.

**Questions of the Day:**

>1) Would you rather be literally immortal or do something that would mean you're never forgotten?

Good question. It's actually a dilemma, literal immortality can be boring after a few milennias and you can't be remembered for the wrong reasons. If I were to chose, I would say literal immortality so I won't have the risk to be remembered as the guy who watched way to much anime.

2) Who would you want to teach you about tao? Shion, Hoko, or Mei?

Shion hands down.

First timer here! Interesting episode. I liked that they explicitly came out and said that the island represents multiple religions, including Taoism/Daoism.

Q1) I don't know, that's a tough one. I think maybe I'd go with actual immortality so I can stick around and see how the world changes. I don't really want to be remembered for anything, unless I end up doing something really good that makes everyone happy.

Q2) That's a tough choice too. I'm gonna say maybe Shion.

**First-timer, subbed** 

Packed episode. Multiple threads and characters uncovering more of the mystery behind this bizzare island. 

The main takeaway is that it's all bound in Tao - the energy that flows through and binds everything. They need to master this to defeat not just the Tensen, but even their right hand fellows. 

Speaking of, don't tell me bandit boy is dead for real this time! I already went through this once. You can't bring him back from the dead just to kill him again the next episode!! He figured out the weakness of the Tensen too - it's their lower body since they're plant-like. Don't tell me they brought him back just to tell us that. 

At least swordsman is still around and he's now joined forces with Gabimaru. But what were those flashes of him and Gabi fighting that we saw? Were those visions of the potential outcome as seen by Maomao Asaemon? 

I like this Tamiya and his surprisingly normal desire to become immortal by doing great deeds. However, this feels like a death flag and I'm worried for him. 

Mei growing up suddenly was a shock and she can speak now?! But she keeps repeating the same thing. Some of it is about this Tao again. 

I enjoyed the editing when we got that lore download. The way we seamlessly switched between the three scenes of Mei, Sagiri & co, and Tenzen's sensei was very nice indeed. Need a bit of time to process the lore itself though. Seems like the entire island is orchestrated by someone who's just slapped together random religious elements. But why?

Things are fast heading for a big showdown and I'm so anxious for our humans. 

**First Timer in Hell’s Subbed Paradise**

>Isn’t there a hot teacher

*shows Shion*

Yes.

***

**A Criminal’s Additional Thoughts**

I don’t even know anymore, I got lost in the gendering tensen, Bandit King’s biceps, and fearing that Mei was about to suddenly become a woman and have feelings for Gabi because *I was there when the deep magic was written* and the deep magic scares me, what was this episode about.

This being a man-made religious system makes sense. But how would someone even acquire so much mystic power to create such an island and its logic? Let alone, why would any mystic power want or allow someone to create false idols and mishmash all these religons?

This Moko man is a fanfiction author who did the most ridiculous canon-divergent AU and tagged the fuck out of it. Good for him.

I’d despise him if he were real.

Those two dudes under their “masks”, are they the left hand and right hand of Moko or whoever created this system?

*Please keep Mei was a cute kiddo.*

*Please let the Bandit King live*.

***

**QotD**

1. If what I can be remembered for is a net-positive? Then that. But there’s nothing I’d ever want for immortality. I already know my cats will pass before I do. I don’t want to keep them and my granddaddy waiting for me on the other side longer than I already am.
2. Shion. He’s daddy.

**Rewatcher (Dub)**

A very exposition-heavy episode, as they seem to be setting up the pieces and ideas for the last 3 episodes of the season. Starting off, we get a confrontation between Gabimaru and Gantetsuai. I do like how Gabimaru seems to be changing his stance now, suggesting they all work together because he realizes he won't be able to take the Tensen on alone. And speaking of changing... Right after we get a strong hint that Mei might be more than she seems last episode, she ends up aging a few years at an unnatural speed. Gabimaru does bring up the idea that she might be similar to the Tensen, but no concrete answers are given just yet. It will be interesting to see how their dynamic might evolve now, especially since she's able to talk now.

Then things shift to Sagiri and the others, where we get a discussion about the island's connection to spiritualism. A topic that's been discussed in great detail by others, so I won't get too deeply into myself. I will say that the idea of Yin and Yang, having a balance, does tie back to some of the character themes, most notably with Sagiri finding a balance between her role as a professional killer and her more compassionate side, both of which has helped her in different ways since coming to the island. And between both main groups and the Nurugai/Shion scenes, it seems like they're each coming to understand how important those ideas are when it comes to fighting on the island.

And finally, we get the return of Toma and Chobei after they climb out of the hole. We do get to learn a bit about the power dynamics between the Soshin and Doshi, which is interesting. But then we see the fight with that Doshi character, leading to Chobei seemingly getting decimated. But whether it's actually fatal or not is yet to be seen. Either way, it does a good job getting the viewer excited for the next episode.

First Timer - Subbed

Oh, OK, this is why all the rewatchers have been so insistent on Taoist or Buddhist philosophy before this. Got it. Uhh. I don't really have much to say since I'm so unfamiliar with this belief system and it really seems like a lot depends on understanding it...

I think it would've worked better if there was already more emphasis on it - we have the whole "choosing the middle" thing with Sagari but... I dunno, I don't see how the other strong characters are exhibiting any of this philosophy. Everyone seems very extreme, very unbalanced in their goals and nothing else so far has matched this Tao. If the power is linked to belief and attitude then it's not really been very consistent.

Convenient Mai's clothes grew with her. Suspicious, a bit, that using her Tao aged her like the Tensen did when they expended almost all their Tao/Tan. Maybe, at the very least, she's been given infusions of Tan keeping her young? Her mind also aging... a bit... I guess... is also curious, not sure where that's going though.

Not sure if I like the explanation being given from multiple characters like this. It gives the impression that all of this is the truth and the absolute truth about Tao, since if it were one character we'd be more suspicious about falsehoods or misunderstandings, but like this it's pretty certain unless all the characters explaining it are lying/misunderstanding what it really is. For a story about a mystery, it seems too sudden and a bit... unsatisfying, really, at least to me.

... how are they being ambushed by these loud, large Titan-like creatures? Aren't they all supposed to be... super-observant, especially the blind guy? Eh, whatever, I won't dwell on it too much. It'd ironically work better if they acted *more* surprised, like they're shocked their senses didn't pick them up, but...

Speaking of him, teaching someone brand new to fighting how to use a sword and effectively fight in a single day? Lol. From personal experience, getting used to footing and stances alone can take like... weeks... And everything on top of that? Yeah no. She really should be just a pure liability from here on out, but this obviously isn't that type of story.

1) I mean, as a Christian, I believe in eternal life anyways so... Literal immortality.

2) Oh is that their names? Hoko, probably.

### Second-time rewatcher, subs

Looks like Gabimaru can cooperate with Gantetsusai and Fuchi, as the two convicts are worthy opponents in regarding raw power. Gantetsusai has no need for the Elixir of Life, but only for to get pardon. He can attain immortality by other means, by his vritue as a swordmaster alone. He wants to be a legend, and even one arm, it is no obstacle either. This island fighting against god-loike almost immortal beings like the Tensen is a good opportunity for this. Mei actually grown-up significantly since that night. Looks like being an entity closer to a Tensen might explains that, or used a huge portion of her energy.

As of why is this island exists, or why it's been like that or the deep religious-philosophical things here, this makes even more mysterious. I don't think Moro Makiya has anything to do with this. One thing is for sdure that really picked up Senta's interest. he sure really likes religious scholarship, right?

Mei explains the Tao, in a very simple thing, probably due to her limited capabilities of speak. The only thing she says "Strong and Weak", but still comprehensible. Well, she is on the point, this is all about harmony, balance of nature, yin and yang, stuff like that. Tanden is basically are some kind of core where Tao flows. "The power that flows through all things", as expected, Tao is the main power system, a life energy which exists and emitted by in all existing living being which flows perpetually. The Tensen could control this perfectly, and have almost infinite reserves. Ordinary humans have Tao, but it's very limited and comprehension and usage has not reached to an advanced stage yet. Once the humans could master it, they might reach a huge potential, but it is no simple or easy task, whether some might achieve it better or worse.

And also the guesses of mine were actually correct regarding Shion. He might be blind due to scars, but reached a point where can sense the Tao energy of other living being, like it's a flowing water. And also some kind of perfection like if he was not blind person. And that is why he can land precise blows on the evil creatures ~~Kunon the Sorcerer~~ Shion the Swordmaster Can See

In order to control Tao, one must reach a balance in body, mind and in emotional state, as it needs to be strong and weak at the same time. Strong or weak only leads nowhere. Once it succeeds it might lead to even greater heights.

Yeah, Chobei and Toma managed to get out of that deep pit, and even the Tensen knew that happened. They will keep moving forward until all Tensen (or any other opposition) are dead. Chobei is truly a barbarian-class berserker, he did eat a monster flesh, which is straight-up cannibalism. But it is one desperate measure to regenerate energy whiuch might allows him to master Tao.

Those Taoist sgae-looking dudes also arrived with a huge monster wave. They came from the Tensen orders. Mei, or the human intruders are definitely involved.

> 1) Would you rather be literally immortal or do something that would mean you're never forgotten?

I would chose the blaze of glory. Immortalized after death. Being a literal immortal would be boring.

> 2) Who would you want to teach you about tao? Shion, Hoko, or Mei?

Both.